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The EA
Dec 20, 2005 22:11:11 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Dec 20, 2005 22:11:11 GMT -1
I have received on behalf of the North Wales Branch of the S&TA a letter from Brynle Williams AM and a copy of a letter from Carwyn to Mr Williams, relative to a small selection of issues Mr Williams raised with the said Minister at the Welsh Assembly. These issues have been passed on at a high level within the 'EA' and now Mr Williams wishes to see me early in the New Year to discuss in finer detail the issues raised and to receive from me a dossier prepared to cover issues from the Sea / Game and Coarse fishing representation on the Welsh Dee and Estuary, Merry Christmas to all of you and lets have a hot on your heels New Year on EA enforcement issues.
Gwyniadun.
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The EA
Dec 28, 2005 9:22:16 GMT -1
Post by wnion on Dec 28, 2005 9:22:16 GMT -1
It looks like the campaign is gathering momentum ; heading in todays(28, December) North wales edition of the Daily post, page 9, SALMON IN DANGER. It goes on to say how North Wales AM Brynle Williams has demanded action from Environment minister Carwyn , highlighting the problem of poaching and the lack of bailiffs. Well done to everyone concerned.
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The EA
Dec 29, 2005 21:38:12 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Dec 29, 2005 21:38:12 GMT -1
Yes Wnion a move in the right direction and much more to come, the Christmas break has turned out to be a constant updating excercise of various issues and interested parties for the dossier, 2006 will prove interesting ;D
Gwyniadun
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The EA
Dec 30, 2005 7:51:18 GMT -1
Post by clwydman on Dec 30, 2005 7:51:18 GMT -1
I am glad to see the focus move into the press and to government. Have heard that some EA fisheries staff have been receiving unwanted post and phonecalls relating to the lack of bailiffing. I am sure this is nothing to do with anyone on this forum, but that is just not on. As I have said before the lack of bailiffs on the river is nothing to do with local EA officers whose support should be absolute from ALL anglers in the area. If improvements are to be made, the right people need to be spoken to (as appears the case now) and the EA fisheries officers on the ground currently need our full support. Personally I would wish to publicly shame any persons involved in verbal harrassment of EA officers they should be kicked out of whatever angling club they are in. We do not need D*** heads fighting the cause. Congratulations to those bringing the situation to the attention of the WAG that is where the money is that is where the fight needs to be! The recent Daily post articles were very interesting. I also have a photograph of raw sewage pouring into the River Clwyd during summer drought. If the photo is any use to anyone, let me know and I will email it to you.
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The EA
Dec 30, 2005 8:18:07 GMT -1
Post by Hoppy on the hoof on Dec 30, 2005 8:18:07 GMT -1
I totally agree with Clwydman, the EA enforcement officers are doing a great job, and any unwarranted post etc is totally out of line.
This forum does not support this action in any way! it must be stopped/
I would echo Clwydman's sentiments, these people need naming and shaming.
Hoppy
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The EA
Dec 30, 2005 17:58:11 GMT -1
Post by highplains on Dec 30, 2005 17:58:11 GMT -1
Fellow anglers,
A happy and prosperous new year to you one and all and tight lines for the coming season.
I have just been speaking to a member of a local angling club here in North Wales, who happened to meet a bailiff whilst down by the river a few days ago. Apparently he was very upset and concerned that some of the postings on this and other sites are being directed at EAW staff, particularly the bailiffs.
Can I make it quite clear from my own point of view that EAW staff generally do a great job and work hard under what must be very difficult circumstances, particularly the enforcement team whom I am sure we all support.
For my own part if I have caused offense to him his colleagues then I apologies without reservation. However the point of the current campaign is not to denigrate the work of the front line staff at the EAW, but to apply pressure to the Welsh Assembly Government and through them to the EAW to increase the staffing levels on enforcement and river protection.
I am advised that the total numbers of Full Time officers were in the past as follows 10 officers on the Dee & Clwyd District (West Kirby on Wirral down to Whitchurch via Chester and across to Bala and up to Pensarn as of all main parts of Elwy. Clwyd and Dee tributaries, inc lakes canals and still water fisheries 14 in the Gwynedd District ( all points west as of Afon Dulas at Llandduals to Borth Near Aberystwyth – all rivers, lakes, still water fisheries and coastline including Anglesey ) The current number, to cover the same area is ten and given that lone working is not acceptable to the EAW for good health and safety reasons this effectively means there are now 5 pairs of bailiffs. And they are expected to deal with fly tipping and other such environment issues as well as protect our waters.
I hope EAW front line staff will accept that we are working to help them get more staff to actually do their jobs the way they would like to be able to do them.
It's nice to see the pressure is building and things may be starting to happen.
Lets hope its a good new year for the EAW and that they will get some increased funding.
All the best
Highplains
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The EA
Dec 30, 2005 20:42:49 GMT -1
Post by Hoppy on Dec 30, 2005 20:42:49 GMT -1
I would like to know where the posts are on this site, that are concerning to EA Bailiffs.
From the outset I have supported the work that the bailiffs do, the problem is that there are not enough of them on the rivers of North Wales.
I appreciate that they are light on the ground, but we all agree that the front line bailiffs do a good job.
I hope that this can get back to the bailiffs concerned?
Hoppy
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The EA
Dec 30, 2005 22:03:53 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Dec 30, 2005 22:03:53 GMT -1
I would like to know where the posts are on this site, that are concerning to EA Bailiffs. Hoppy I would also like to know, we are in support of the 'Bailiffs' and trying to get their employers to acknowledge that we need more of them. Gwyniadun
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The EA
Jan 5, 2006 17:03:39 GMT -1
Post by Torgoch on Jan 5, 2006 17:03:39 GMT -1
Highplains. It seems your comments have hit a few raw nerve endings with the EA and it's staff. I'm sure the men on the ground can see whats going on and are discreetly applauding the present situation and no doubt being gagged from publicly commenting, and from whats been said its now no secret that the senior managers are very wound up over the complaints in public places that they are presiding over failures to get the job done and not truly engaging with the main customers of the rivers of N.Wales maybe its time to buy a canoe, as you get more sympathy out of the EA at Bangor by all acount. what does make me and many other anglers wonder i'm sure is how a very newly appointed officer who's got very little experience himself in dealing with poachers has got himself an assistant ?? I make a point of referring to the paragraph that relates to this issue br]I have just been speaking to a member of a local angling club here in North Wales, who happened to meet **************** the new bailiff with responsibility for the Clwyd and his assistant whilst down by the river a few days ago. Apparently **** was very upset and concerned that some of the postings on this and other sites are being directed at EAW staff, particularly the bailiffs.
I now ask this, was the the source of info correct to say this other EA officer with ********* an assistant or was it a error of words with a flair for a Napoleonic type conotation by the EA Officer. What the rivers, lakes and all other fisheries in North Wales need is highly trained trained staff who are totally in tune with the anglers on the beat, can turn to any angling club for help and assistance and know they will get it. talking to other anglers in North West Wales its an entirely different situation where some EA officers haven't been seen patrolling their beats for a few years and for reasons as yet unknown, and may never be explained. Lets hope the new chap responsible for the Clwyd area can gain a reputation for getting things done quickly without quibble or hinderance. I'd like to wish him well for the future too.
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The EA
Jan 6, 2006 11:20:43 GMT -1
Post by highplains on Jan 6, 2006 11:20:43 GMT -1
Torgoch,
Thanks for your comments, lets hope something good happens as a result. I wait with keen anticipation to see the results of the Welsh S&T efforts after having been handed command of the cause. Lets hope they are successful.
There has been a fair amount of publicity in the press and on the radio lately which can be no bad thing.
My comments on the bailiff on the Clwyd and his assistant may be incorrect in terms of 'assistant' although that was the term used in the conversation I had. Lets hope so but I fear not, enforcement officer numbers are way to low!!!
It would be nice to think that EAW staff may sign up to the forum thus allowing them to comment anonymously on the topics raised. They could then help us to help them. We shall see.
Tight lines for the coming season and thanks again for your comment.
Regards.
Highplains
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The EA
Jan 31, 2006 20:52:34 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Jan 31, 2006 20:52:34 GMT -1
I have received on behalf of the North Wales Branch of the S&TA a letter from Brynle Williams AM and a copy of a letter from Carwyn to Mr Williams, relative to a small selection of issues Mr Williams raised with the said Minister at the Welsh Assembly. These issues have been passed on at a high level within the 'EA' and now Mr Williams wishes to see me early in the New Year to discuss in finer detail the issues raised and to receive from me a dossier prepared to cover issues from the Sea / Game and Coarse fishing representation on the Welsh Dee and Estuary, Merry Christmas to all of you and lets have a hot on your heels New Year on EA enforcement issues. Gwyniadun. Doesn't time fly!!!, well just to let you know that this matter has not just gone away, to the contrary, a reply to the issues raised was received from the EA signed by Mr Moore from the Bangor Office. This reply prompted another letter for clarification purposes, and a meeting arranged with Mr Brynle Williams, the newly drafted letter arrived with Mr Carwyn the Minister at the Welsh Assembly today. I am confident that eventually we shall see the issues raised, answered and finalised in order that I may report to you in full where the problems lie and more to the point what is going to happen about these problems. I appologise for being vague at present but be assured that the matter is moving and gathering momentum, through the right chanels. Gwyniadun
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The EA
Feb 28, 2006 17:41:30 GMT -1
Post by buzzerman on Feb 28, 2006 17:41:30 GMT -1
im with hoppy ,if still water fisheries manangers were made to ask for your licence,would people not go anymore ,i dont think so ,there would be more money taken and we could then lobby to get our moneys worth ,in stead of having a go at each other ,lets think of ways we can make sure everybody pays the right amount to fish then we can use so called presure groups in the right way
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The EA
Feb 28, 2006 17:44:56 GMT -1
Post by buzzerman on Feb 28, 2006 17:44:56 GMT -1
still water and river bailiffs/owners should be allowed to issue day tickets[e.a. permits ] that would take a lot of pressure of the claim that to many people arent payig there dues
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The EA
Mar 4, 2006 11:00:11 GMT -1
Post by Torgoch on Mar 4, 2006 11:00:11 GMT -1
Buzzerman wrote :- still water and river bailiffs/owners should be allowed to issue day tickets[e.a. permits ] that would take a lot of pressure of the claim that to many people arent payig there dues
maybe the idea looks a good one but is a none starter in reality. mostly due to the lawles society we live in as we all know. the selling of licences on river banks would be a target for muggers and as we know, certain trusted fishery owners are already selling EA day licences as well as the fisheries own day permit. club keepers on some waters already carry a book of permits and sell them bankside on enclosed waters and certain small river fisheries which helps a clubs cash flow, however to sell rod licences in the present climate would take a total re think of the EA's policy as is known at present.it wasn't so long ago that the former NRA took licences out of tackle shops because it was faced with a small minority of dealers failing to stump up the receipts which gave all others a pasting with the same tarring. I might have it wrong, but I'm fairly sure the EA boys wouldn't want money loading them down when they have other big fish to fry when dealing with fly tippers
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The EA
Mar 10, 2006 7:05:23 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Mar 10, 2006 7:05:23 GMT -1
My first letter to Brynle Williams was dated the 23rd November 2005 which generated a reply from the EA via Carwyn the Minister dated the 10th January 2006, this prompted another letter dated the 26th January 2006 to Mr Williams as the points raised had not been answered. I received a reply to this letter dated the 20th February 2006 . A meeting with the minister Carwyn had been put on hold to await the reply which is now at hand, the next stage is another meeting with Mr Williams and with Mr Carwyn at Cardiff. For obvious reasons I't would be unwise to disclose all the 'facts' prior to this meeting, and will need to clear the next move with the Salmon and Trout Association in London, at this stage I consider that the value of the 'Media' in all its guises is one way forward, lets work on 'true facts', I am sure that we shall succeed one way or another. I really feel sorry for the dedicated 'Fisheries Enforecement Officers' of the EA in North Wales, lets see now is it 5 or 8 or is it 18, I'm not too sure on this point after the last letter received.
Can anyone come up with figure for me of the Honorary Bailiffs that existed in North Wales in the late 70's, I am aware that they were given an honorarium of £300 each per year and some kit and they carried a 'Full Water Bailiff's Warrant' in support of the 26 'Full time' Water Bailiffs that existed then.
(This morning 10th March 1420 hits on this)
Gwyniadun
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The EA
Mar 21, 2006 18:14:18 GMT -1
Post by rwgbridgend on Mar 21, 2006 18:14:18 GMT -1
It is nice to hear that the effort in North Wales is going well, with the local Assembly member being involved. Down here in Bridgend I have also been busy and have written to our local AM Janice Gregory who is awaiting a reply from the EA. Here in this EA Region, we do not have any bailiffs at present covering the Ogmore, Afan and Neath systems!! Our last remaining Bailiff has not worked for the EA since before Christmas. What a situation to be in when there were once over 12 bailiffs covering this area alone. I cannot divulge too much at present, but i have provided our Assmebly Member with quite specific information regarding actual incidents which demonstrate a complete lack of management with regards to enforcement in this region. I hope to hear of some progress soon and will keep you all posted. I hope that the effort in North Wales continues to go well.
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The EA
Mar 27, 2006 20:44:27 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Mar 27, 2006 20:44:27 GMT -1
Thanks for that 'rwgbridgend' you are moving in the right direction, I wish you well in your quest, I have some information that might interest you, please pm me matters are still moving ahead and our AM Brynle Williams is making some progress, we are waiting on Carwyn to reply now.
Gwyniadun
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The EA
Mar 29, 2006 13:43:16 GMT -1
Post by Hoppy on Mar 29, 2006 13:43:16 GMT -1
Still awaiting an update for the forum.
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The EA
Apr 4, 2006 6:50:41 GMT -1
Post by Gwyniadun on Apr 4, 2006 6:50:41 GMT -1
EA Enforcement. It is a long winded affair to say the least for definitive answers to be given to various questions asked of the EA in North Wales over the ‘Enforcement’ Issues. On behalf of the North Wales Branch of the Salmon and Trout Association, several of the members are disillusioned with the response and replies to the queries raised and also feel that the EA Management no longer has the interest of ‘Fisheries Enforcement’ at heart. The letters in both instances were addressed to Carwyn at the Welsh Assembly and replied to by Mr Steve Moore, Area Manager EA North Wales. Brynle Williams our AM is also waiting for a reply over these very issues from Carwyn the Minister at the Welsh Assembly. It is very disturbing when questions are asked of the EA and the replies given, well, I will let you draw your own conclusions from the following selected replies received, signed by Mr Steve Moore. We know that not all that long ago there were ‘24 Fully Warranted Bailiffs’ in North Wales,ten in the Dee and Clwyd area and fourteen in Gwynedd. 1. Why has the ‘Enforcement Team’ of the EA been reduced? Reply: Quote: The Enforcement Team has not been reduced and as previously stated has a total of 8 warranted Officers, although we have a vacancy that is being actively filled. In my letter of the 23rd November 2005 I asked the following question relative to a Fully Equipped Vessel purchased by the EA with the intention of patrolling costal area’s in NorthWales as an ‘Enforcement Exercise’, Relative to the Dee Estuary alone. 2. How many ‘Enforcement Officers’ are trained and qualified to use this vessel? How many ‘Enforcement Officers’ are conversant with the navigational complexities in the Dee Estuary? Do the EA work with or alongside DEFRA on issues involving the Dee Estuary? How many patrols took place in 2004/5. Reply: Quote: The Agency work jointly with DEFRA to target illegal netting on the River Dee Estuary to protect Salmon, Seatrout and the Bass Nursery sites. There were two joint operations carried out in 2004/5. No boat patrols were carried out in the Dee Estuary during 2004/5 as the new boat was not fully operational. However there were numerous land based patrols and enforcement operations carried out on and around the estuary. As the reply did not adequately cover the question posed, I again asked the following questions in the second letter. 3.How many Enforcement Officers are trained to use this vessel? How many Enforcement Officers are conversant with the Navigational Complexities in the Dee Estuary. This is ‘Fully Warranted Enforcement Officers’ Reply: Quote: The ‘Environmental Crime Team’ has four fully warranted officers that are trained and qualified to use the boat. Two Fully warranted and two officers with restricted warrants are trained to be able to deal with the navigational complexities in the Dee Estuary. Again the point is missed completely, the reply ‘trained to be able to deal with the navigational complexities in the Dee Estuary’ does not mean that the persons referred to have any knowledge of the complexities at various heights of the tide and likely area’s that Illegal activities could be taking place. Members had drawn attention to the 0800 number facility for reporting ‘Poaching’ incidents in the area of the Dee and Clwyd catchment , three reports were selected which had been marked as ‘Non agency Business’ Reply: Quote: The Agency’s 0800 number is a twenty four hour , seven days a week bilingual service and operated b the Regional Communication centre Based in Cardiff. All incidents reported to the Agency are routed through this way and during normal working hours the fisheries incidents are forwarded to the Environmental Crime Team for investigation. Incidents are classified using the Agency’s Common Incident Classification system, which is used to decide the appropriate level of response, based upon environmental impact to ensure that we use resources wisely. A rundown on each of the incidents followed, but no explanation as to why they had been marked up as ‘Non agency Business’ which prompted in our second letter the question ‘Why has two of the reported incidents been set as ‘Non agency business’? which is the exact wording on the documents at hand. Reply: Quote: Both incidents were classified and investigated in accordance with the Common Incident Classification System. However on both reports the event type field was set incorrectly, as “not of interest to the agency”. Since the reports were completed, all Environmental Crime team Officers have received refresher training in the use of the National Incident Recording system, to ensure all reports are now completed correctly. Nothing about the fact that no one was apprehended. I have been invited to meet with Mr Moore. The Salmon and Trout Association have a wish to enhance ‘Fisheries Interest’ and we believe that ‘Enforcement’ plays a major role in this, I will await the reply from Carwyn with interest. Recently the Harbour Master from Mostyn Dock reported in a local Chester Newspaper, problems encountered by the Barge that travels up the River from Mostyn to Hawarden to pick up the aircraft wings for shipping to France, both by day and night. At night especially, Fishing boats without lights with nets across the channel, he points out that it is an offence to be without lights on a boat at night and that the fishermen were causing danger to themselves….. wonder who they are and what they are fishing for…..has the EA picked up on this. It must be said that some spring Salmon were encountered in the Trap at Chester weir around the same time as the newspaper report, you know, the mind boggles, here we are imposed with a Byelaw that we can not keep Salmon until the 16th June in an attempt to enhance stocks which are dangerously low…. What’s happening in the Estuary? This is a picture mailed to me in January 2006 taken in early October 2005...between Mostyn and Flint...What kind of fish is this? enlarge the photo to see the fish and do you have any idea who these are? Gwyniadun
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The EA
Apr 4, 2006 17:16:57 GMT -1
Post by John F on Apr 4, 2006 17:16:57 GMT -1
I've been angling for nearly twenty years at an age whereby it has been a legal requirement for me to posses a license.
In all of this time "most of it spent course fishing and reservoir trout fishing" I have been asked to produce my license only once, and that was by a police officer at weirwood reservoir.
For the most case, it is the clubs and members who look after their waters (not crapping in ones nest so to speak).
I have seen serious pollution issues in my time, for instance, in Northampton in the late eighties, the Carlsberg factory dumped "YES DUMPED" tonnes of yeast into the river Nene, thus totally dis-oxygenating the river for miles and killing thousands upon thousands of fish and other marine life. That river "in my opinion" never recovered from that.
I don't mind admitting that I cried my bloody heart out when I saw the devastation for the first time, I was actually fishing a back water when a guy walking his dog explained "Hey sonny, I think your wasting your time! Go and have a look at the main river". So I did and found thousands of fish all dead and dying.
Carlsberg was fined a pathetic amount of money for this action, and I was disgusted that the EA would not even participate in the clean up, which lead to even more pollution. The rats thrived on the rotting flesh though!
On another occasion whereby I have had contact with the EA; I live in the town of Newport (Isle of Wight) and we have a tidal river here called the Medina. In the summer mornings I walk to work crossing a small bridge and often leave 20 Min's early with a loaf of bread to feed the mullet that frequent this area.
One morning whilst feeding these mullet (after some pretty horrendous rain) I was gob smacked to have a common carp of @ 25lb take some of the bread, on further inspection of the river I counted well in excess of twenty carp. I knew that on the next spring high water these fish were done for.
I phoned the EA and the long and short of it (useless). Firstly they admitted that they did not have the equipment or the man power on the Island to deal with such a problem. Secondly, when I offered to at least have a go at re-locating the fish I was informed that this would be an illegal act! WTF
Useful?
OK, I understand the fact that re-location could have caused problems with disease or something, but I did explain to the EA rep at the time that I knew of a couple of empty stew ponds that were available and that the owner of these ponds was very keen to look after these fish for however long it takes for the EA to run tests on the fish before release.
I honestly for the life of me cannot see a problem with that, can you guys?
The EA still insisted that it would be illegal, so I dropped the matter!
I don't know what all the fuss was about any way, as on my next morning visit to the bridge, all but four of those carp had gone, well of the ones I knew about in any case. I haven't a clue what happened to them. I just hope they are safe and well.
On a personal note;
I'm not bothered about seeing more bailiffs on the bank checking for licenses, I'd rather not see one at all checking paperwork, if I saw one in a blue moon picking up paper and other crap. Ever seen that? I never have! I see plenty of clubs and their maintenance crews out doing it though.
Besides which, we license holders all have the right to ask another angler to produce his/her license (this is a good one if you're big enough and want to fish that magic pool thats occupied).
Although you have the right to do so, would you be prepared to do it? Personally I'd rather be fishing than drowning, which is why I pay for someone else to do it!!!!
If I combine the annual subs of the three clubs I belong to this does not even come near the amount I would pay for my license, and yes they deal with environmental issues, maintenance, stocking etc etc. The EA doesn't even enter the equation.
Sorry guys but I simply fail to see where the money goes to, and that is country wide!
As I said, it's the locals who look after their territory and not the EA. You only have to look at the sheep dip problem, the EA had the d**ning evidence and did what? Not a great deal until the S&TA got a hold of it?
I may not have a clue what I'm talking about? But I go by practical things such as what I can see and read.
The intention now is to hit us sea anglers with licensing!
Hum, fun!
On the upside to the EA. I intend to visit Wales once a year for a couple of days fishing early season. I can only manage these couple of days due to work commitments. Yet I will stll pay out for a migratory trout license and a full one at that, just in case I get another chance during the year?
Besides which, I want stress free fishing and could not achieve this without a license. It is extremely difficult casting a fly with one eye looking over my shoulder, you see, I'm not that lucky!
However, as I pay my dosh and take my chance with a fish or two in the knowledge that I am legally right to be there. I will still do as I do, and thank/support the club that represents the water I am fishing, as these are the people that make the water what it is and not the EA.
Maybe I've just had bad experience, but the matter of fact is that I do not believe I'm getting anywhere near value for money from the license fee, in fact I see it as yet another TAX for my leisure!
But then again, this TAX might be doing us some good? I honestly don't know! I do not have the time to trawl through all of the information available with regards to the worth of the EA! Who has? As said previously, I go by practicality and my opinion resides on that.
Sorry to ramble on, but it is a touchy subject with me.
John F
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